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T O P I C    R E V I E W
SteveW25561 Posted - 06/20/2012 : 11:53:16 PM
I've been searching and reading, but honestly the answers are a bit above my head.

I have a cottage and want to control the heating via WiFi. We have several baseboard heaters, 220 V using Honeywell 2 lead thermostats with a simple rotary control.

I'd love to set up a WiFi enabled thermostat control for the place, ideally controlling 3 or 4 of the heaters so the place is warm when we get there in the winter. Even better would be if there's a smartphone app that allows you to see the temperatures, but I'd be OK with simply turning on the heat to the temps set at the wall-mounted thermostats.

I found this: Aube-TH115-A-240D-3600w-2-Pole-Baseboard-Thermostat
http://www.smarthome.com/300607B/Aube-TH115-A-240D-3600w-2-Pole-Baseboard-Thermostat/p.aspx

And the Aube telephone controller, but I don't have a phone line (but do have WiFi/broadband -- I could potentially use a MagicJack I guess). I'd still prefer a WiFi setup.

Adding the Insteon IO Link to each Aube thermostat would probably look pretty ugly (wall plug, 2 wires up to the Aube thermostat, plus I think it needs an additional 12V line), so I'd like to avoid this. Other posts I've seen suggested 12V relays and the using the more available low voltage Insteon thermostats, but this seems daunting to me (I plan to DIY).

Does anyone make a simple, all in 1 Insteon comptable thermostat that works with a 2-wire baseboard heater?

Otherwise, can someone suggest a shopping list to make this work? The older posts I found were from 2009 and 2010 so I'm hoping there's more out there now. I'd prefer minimizing the number of wires etc needed, and a direct plug and play replacement of the existing Honeywell rotary thermostats would be ideal!



30   L A T E S T    R E P L I E S    (Newest First)
charlesey Posted - 08/05/2019 : 04:47:45 AM
I see lots of grumbles from customers that purchased these thermostat. They complain that the thermostats are not self-connecting to Wi-Fi system.
mohsen256 Posted - 08/04/2019 : 11:50:18 AM
thanks . i want to control bms system by wifi module
Truesh Posted - 05/25/2019 : 03:25:28 AM
I am considering a Honeywell 9320 thermostat model with wi-fi control for installation in my home https://whatever-tech.com/honeywell-reviews-9580-vs-9585-vs-9320. Now most of the equipment in my house is controlled via wi-fi, and it is very convenient. Features of this model is that it is compatible with 24-volt heating, ventilation and air conditioning, gas, electric, oil and dual-fuel heating, remote access is provided through the application Honeywell Total Comfort. Who else is using this model? Would love to hear feedback.
dan1el Posted - 05/23/2019 : 03:03:37 AM
I have an electric heater (from Duraflame https://wisepick.org/best-heater-for-large-room/) in my garage.
I also have smart home switches.
I took a plug in smart outlet controller, that I plugged in a 110v control voltage relay into, and that switches the heater's control voltage on and off.
Thermostat duties are controlled by the simple factory thermostat. But if I wanted to get tricky, I could use a 24vac control side relay hooked to a standard house thermostat to control it as well, and could even go as far to get a WIFI thermostat to do the switching duties.
joeltimm Posted - 01/09/2019 : 04:02:01 AM
I triple checked my wiring, but I wouldn't put it past myself to still have it wrong. I bought new relays, and another thermostat, and am going to double check every part this weekend. Thanks for the responses, and I'll update when I sort it.
BLH Posted - 01/09/2019 : 03:38:56 AM
The transformer is always On when the AC input is connected. Around 24 Volts AC between C and R. I doubt two of them would have the exact same voltage between C and R. So there maybe some current between the two controllers. C is only used to power thermostats that use an external power source. So using one would be best.

The control has a internal relay coil connected to the C and the W terminal. R is connected to the other internal transformer output. When you connect R to W. The relay turns On and the relays contacts power the device on the Red wire.

I doubt having the two C terminals connected would be causing you problem. If using one fixed it let us know.

It could be a defective module with a stuck relay or your wiring is not correct. Can you tell from the wiring that you have all the correct wires connected to each other?
joeltimm Posted - 01/08/2019 : 5:49:10 PM
Maybe that's it! I have the c wire connected all the way through. First relay to second relay to thermostat. Do you think that the power from the c from the first relay is continually powering the transformer to give heat? And vice versa? That would explain why they are all on all the time. I'm just not familiar with the technical details on how things work so work. (Though the second relay did hit me with 220 when it was only connected to the low voltage from the first relay)....

I have 2 relays because the heaters total about 7,000 watts, so I have about 3500 on each relay.
BLH Posted - 01/08/2019 : 07:43:35 AM
Two in parallel. Do you need a higher current than one can control?

The Black from the both modules connected together and to L1 of the 240.

The Blue from both modules connected together to L2 of the 240 and one side of the heating element connected together.

The Red from both modules connected to the other side of the heating element.

The W from both modules together and to the thermostat W.
The R from both modules together and to the thermostat R.
If the thermostat needs power from C. Did you connect them together and to the thermostat C? Only one C needs to provide power. The second C should be left not connected.
joeltimm Posted - 01/08/2019 : 04:33:11 AM
Thanks Stu and everyone for all the great information!

I got the RC840T-240 Aube relays, and wired 2 in parallel, before going to my 3rd generation nest. I'm running into a problem where everything seems to be wired correctly, but the heaters won't turn off!

The red indicator lights on both relays turn on when the thermostat calls for heat, then turn off when the thermostat stops calling for heat, but the heat stays on. I left them for connected for 6 hours without the thermostat calling for heat, and the heaters were still cranking out heat.

I have 2 relays in parallel, like on the diagram I think Stu suggested. Then I Have L1 going to black, L2 connected to blue + one side of the heater, then the other side of the heater connected to red.

Any ideas what could be the problem? Faulty relays? Something else? Does having the 2 relays wired in parallel affect anything with the heater wiring?

Thanks so much for any help!
Monika888 Posted - 05/04/2018 : 2:22:58 PM
Great thread! I'm going to renovate my house and I'm thinking about changing a heating system. Unfortunately, I'm clueless about all this stuff, including thermostats. So, your posts are very helpful for me. I want to explore the issue by myself, but anyway I'll hire a HVAC service to do the work.
jamescobb Posted - 03/31/2018 : 7:12:22 PM
I bought Sinopé GT125 thermostat to add to my home system because it was the best price with the most features I could find for my baseboard heaters. This system uses a proprietary radio but offers API access through the cloud that I needed.

Amazing product!! Works as a incredible standalone thermostat but the wireless capabilities adds so much more like auto off when leaving home. Extremely simple to install and instructions makes that process even simpler.

I like the fact that even if the internet or SmartThings goes down the system will continue to function normally, but you will need internet access to initially program the start/stop times and other settings.

This is definitely a rare find, glad to come across it. Will update if issues arise.
jfcouture Posted - 03/10/2018 : 10:14:09 AM
=== Update ===

I have been using Sinopé thermostst at my cottage for more than 2 years now. They are working very well. I added 2 thermostats in my detached garage and they connect to the web interface even though the garage is more than 40 feet from my house.

2 years ago, Sinopé was the only retrofit solution available. Since, other providers have come out with similar products, with z-wave or zigbee connectivity. They are more expansive options. Sinopé now also offer zigbee thermostats, and other connected devices like load controllers. Stelpro is also offering zwave and zigbee thermostats as well.

The load controllers are interesting as to control my water pump and water hester, i had to use a relay and a wireless switch. This works well, but the si opé load controller would do better.

If i was to redo this again now, i would probably go with a zigbee or zwave option rather than the original sinope thermostats that require the web interface for

Smarto Posted - 01/10/2018 : 5:45:57 PM
[quote]Originally posted by bbarbour24

For electric baseboard heaters, there are currently two options for wifi (or connected) thermostats and 1 option for smart thermostats.

Please see this article to learn more about Mysa, Sinop�, and Caleo:
https://getmysa.com/blogs/2017/11/23/a-guide-to-smart-thermostats-which-one-works-for-me/


Thanks for the info. This is great because it's the first smart thermostat for baseboard heater that works with Alexa, Google Home and Homekit.
brucecs63 Posted - 01/10/2018 : 5:25:46 PM
I went with the Sinope option. Bought the starter kit, came with 2 thermostats and the base unit. Its one of the few idiot proof setups that went smooth.. well almost smooth. It works on the website, to setup. The browser i used.. wouldnt work. Tried another browser, worked great. I added 3 more thermostats. So far.. i am happy.
bbarbour24 Posted - 01/10/2018 : 12:22:34 PM
For electric baseboard heaters, there are currently two options for wifi (or connected) thermostats and 1 option for smart thermostats.

Please see this article to learn more about Mysa, Sinop�, and Caleo:
https://getmysa.com/blogs/2017/11/23/a-guide-to-smart-thermostats-which-one-works-for-me/

Smarto Posted - 10/05/2017 : 6:32:18 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Blucid

The main reason is, I would like remote control, and away control. Once the kids come I dont want to run around the house adjusting the thermos all the time. Some rooms will never be heated, but I would like to be able to setup schedules, because that would save money in the long run.



Blucid, most programmable thermostat has schedule. What I did last winter with my space heaters is that I connect them through an iDevices smart plug. Then I cycled ON-OFF every hour or half an hour, effectively cutting down my heating cost in half while the temperature in the house is pretty much the same. I can also control my heaters remotely as well as reading the temperature of the house through another smart thermometer or through my main Nest. By the way, I got my Nest working through an Aube relay for my electric baseboard heater, but it is a pain.
Blucid Posted - 10/05/2017 : 08:05:13 AM
The main reason is, I would like remote control, and away control. Once the kids come I dont want to run around the house adjusting the thermos all the time. Some rooms will never be heated, but I would like to be able to setup schedules, because that would save money in the long run.
gwydionjhr Posted - 10/04/2017 : 8:06:19 PM
I would echo scavenger's comments. Being able to treat each room as a zone, and having the temps adjusted by where we are in the house at what time of day is gravy. Being able to see, get feedback on the changes you make is a huge plus.
scavenger Posted - 10/04/2017 : 4:13:11 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Smarto

quote:
Originally posted by scavenger

quote:
Originally posted by Blucid

I have been following, this topic for almost a year now. I moved into a new home 1 year ago. Its a brand new town house, 3 floors and it has 11. Thats right 11 baseboard heaters. Is it even worth it for me to try to smart-home / thermostat this place.

It might save me some money down the road after it pays off but is it worth the hassle? What do you guys think?



Yes, absolutely. My house has 10 Sinopés installed and I love it. I think of my home as covered in a mesh network of temperature probes; I can see what areas suck more $$$ out of my wallet and tune the node output accordingly. The more the better, IMO.

They aren’t hard to install.



Scavenger, what benefits do you get from the Sinope compared to a regular thermostat, other than you can control it remotely?



Controlling them remotely was actually the least interesting feature when I decided to get the Sinope. My house is pretty open, with lofts and wide open spaces. The thermostats we had before were really bad rotary analog things, you know the kind, with "comfort zones" of maybe 20 degrees of error in them, and no actual temps listed on the gauge.

Having the digital precision was good, but the killer feature is in their web interface. They have a demo you can check out.

The temperature history and metrics is the biggest feature for me. Seeing the house as a mesh network of temperature probes is great, because you can tweak the output manually to save the most money. That allowed me to see that setting the temperature of the big 2.5KW wall cans in the main room equally to the other clusters of lower-wattage cans in the same room was costing me a huge amount of money each month.

Dialing the big can down a couple degrees and the smaller cans up by a degree balanced the output and lowered the cost significantly. Between the digital accuracy and the zone tuning, I saved maybe 50% that first month on heating, and those savings continued, though that's more a comment on how inefficient our old thermostats were.
Smarto Posted - 10/04/2017 : 3:37:06 PM
quote:
Originally posted by scavenger

quote:
Originally posted by Blucid

I have been following, this topic for almost a year now. I moved into a new home 1 year ago. Its a brand new town house, 3 floors and it has 11. Thats right 11 baseboard heaters. Is it even worth it for me to try to smart-home / thermostat this place.

It might save me some money down the road after it pays off but is it worth the hassle? What do you guys think?



Yes, absolutely. My house has 10 Sinopés installed and I love it. I think of my home as covered in a mesh network of temperature probes; I can see what areas suck more $$$ out of my wallet and tune the node output accordingly. The more the better, IMO.

They aren’t hard to install.



Scavenger, what benefits do you get from the Sinope compared to a regular thermostat, other than you can control it remotely?
scavenger Posted - 10/04/2017 : 3:18:45 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Blucid

I have been following, this topic for almost a year now. I moved into a new home 1 year ago. Its a brand new town house, 3 floors and it has 11. Thats right 11 baseboard heaters. Is it even worth it for me to try to smart-home / thermostat this place.

It might save me some money down the road after it pays off but is it worth the hassle? What do you guys think?



Yes, absolutely. My house has 10 Sinopés installed and I love it. I think of my home as covered in a mesh network of temperature probes; I can see what areas suck more $$$ out of my wallet and tune the node output accordingly. The more the better, IMO.

They aren’t hard to install.
Smarto Posted - 10/04/2017 : 3:05:01 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Blucid

I have been following, this topic for almost a year now. I moved into a new home 1 year ago. Its a brand new town house, 3 floors and it has 11. Thats right 11 baseboard heaters. Is it even worth it for me to try to smart-home / thermostat this place.

It might save me some money down the road after it pays off but is it worth the hassle? What do you guys think?




Brucid, a regular thermostat will do the job of controlling the heater to maintain a temperature. A semi smart thermostat such as the Sinope will allow you to set the temperature and control the heater remotely. A smarter thermostat such as the Nest or Ecobee will learn when you are at home or away, or have multiple sensors to know the temperature in various places in your home to control the heater accordingly.
Blucid Posted - 10/04/2017 : 2:15:53 PM
I have been following, this topic for almost a year now. I moved into a new home 1 year ago. Its a brand new town house, 3 floors and it has 11. Thats right 11 baseboard heaters. Is it even worth it for me to try to smart-home / thermostat this place.

It might save me some money down the road after it pays off but is it worth the hassle? What do you guys think?
jeff_arko Posted - 08/29/2017 : 08:15:02 AM
UPDATE : 9/15/17 : Installed & Working Great.
- - - - - - - -

WOO-HOO! Sinope has released their new DOUBLE-POLE, Wi-Fi, 240V, programmable line voltage thermostat.
It's a beauty -- I've already ordered 3. They arrived at my house yesterday (8/28/17) along with the web interface.
Finally ... I can upgrade all my thermostats! I'll post again next week after they are in.

(NOTE: No, I don't work at Sinope. Just happy someone released a product that suits our needs!!)

THERMOSTATS
http://www.sinopetech.com/en/boutique/products/neviweb-en/double-pole-thermostat-for-electric-heating-web-programmable-3600-w/

WEB INTERFACE
http://www.sinopetech.com/en/boutique/products/neviweb-en/web-gateway/

brucecs63 Posted - 02/26/2017 : 4:33:44 PM
Hope some people can relate to this about HA and the cloud using Alexa. Last night I was absolutely killing my 50 gig up and down that Alexa couldn't connect. I gave up trying to tell Alexa to turn off my Wemo controlled outlet room light that I had to get out of bed to actually turn off the switch on the lamp. Dark Ages indeed ;)

Bruce
Smarto Posted - 02/26/2017 : 12:01:41 PM
quote:
Originally posted by stusviews

There are no thermostats nor switches than I'm aware of that require the cloud to be functional. Some do require the cloud for remote or voice control, but that's the very reason for installing such devices.

Not everyone want HA. If you don't, then such products are not for you. Personally, nearly every device in my home is automated and we really enjoy that. Lights turn on when we enter a darkened room, especially handy if your hands are full, window covering operate based on the time of day/night or position of the sun, doors lock automatically in the event we forget, much, much more.

As far as companies going belly up, consider the automobile industry



Well you do need the Amazon or Apple cloud in order for your Alexa or Homekit devices to work. Nevertheless, I don't know of any device that you cannot operate manually to override the automation.

Having said this, in order for the cloud to disappear then you have to bet that Amazon and Apple will go bankrupted some day without anybody buying them and take over the cloud. Possible but probably not in my lifetime

Yep once you have experienced home automation then you will never go back, like voice control, automatic turning off or on when you leave your home or come back, automatic running based on a scene...

It's like if people still resist to use the remote control for the TV in 2017.
gwydionjhr Posted - 02/26/2017 : 11:39:38 AM
There is a difference between a proprietary cloud, and a cloud.
stusviews Posted - 02/26/2017 : 11:36:17 AM
There are no thermostats nor switches than I'm aware of that require the cloud to be functional. Some do require the cloud for remote or voice control, but that's the very reason for installing such devices.

Not everyone want HA. If you don't, then such products are not for you. Personally, nearly every device in my home is automated and we really enjoy that. Lights turn on when we enter a darkened room, especially handy if your hands are full, window covering operate based on the time of day/night or position of the sun, doors lock automatically in the event we forget, much, much more.

As far as companies going belly up, consider the automobile industry
gwydionjhr Posted - 02/26/2017 : 12:12:48 AM
Which is why IMHO the Stelpros are the best choice, they operate on a standard that any smarthome hub can integrate, if the maker chooses to do so. And of the two, the ZigBee standard, because it's basically Wi-Fi, might end up being the winner in the long run.

You really need to take a visit to the Smarthomedb dot com and have a look at which devices combine/integrate best with which hubs.

Buy a thermostat that relies on a proprietary cloud to operate... company goes bust or decides to stop supporting your thermostats; you have some very nice wall ornaments

Buy a hub that relies on a proprietary protocol, and devices that connect with that same proprietary protocol... company goes bust, or gets bought (look up Revolv) then you're SOL.

Build a smarthome setup around a "free" service with no visible means of support (I'm lookin' at you IFTTT) what happens when that collapses?

I'm going to keep my devices as platform agnostic as I can, and if the hub I'm using goes belly up, I'll switch to another, but at I'll still have the opportunity to keep on using my devices.

$4 for a lightswitch that I know will continue to work for 25-50 years, and we don't think twice about it.

$40-80 for a lightswitch that might do nothing more than turn the light on/off with the push of a button in 5 years because it's "cloud" is gone. No thanks.
Smarto Posted - 02/25/2017 : 8:12:49 PM
quote:
Originally posted by gwydionjhr

It looks to me like the Nest + Aube solution requires running wires between the thermostat and the relay. So while it looks like it may save a few bucks up front, the installation costs will most likely outweigh those saving.

The Sinope and Stelpros are basically plug and play. I'm not going to speak to the Caleos because I'm personally leery of what they're offering.



From a standpoint of a remotely controlled thermostat then I agree that there are cheaper and better solutions than Nest + Aube. But from the standpoint of Smarthome with Homekit, Alexa and Google Home in the future then I want the Nest or Ecobee with Nest being the better choice. I really kick myself for not having Homekit or Alexa integration but at the same time it may be just a gimmick

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